Balancing the playing field...

Dumpsterslut · 09-30-2010, 07:42 PM

Every rpg I've ever played (for the most part) casters can't wear the same armor as warriors/rogues/paladins etc. Wearing heavy armor is a treat reserved for us tanks/melee primaries who have to nickle and dime everything to death.

Now with the advent of potions that grant obscene amounts of AC I see a huge issue. Instead of reinventing the entire armory I have a patch idea that might even things up in PvP.

Yeah, yeah, casters miss out on stats and AC bonus of an archery set, but a quiver's AC is a far cry from the squishyness they should have to give any melee based class a decent shot at them.

When I see staffies hitting for 2200 on a double cast in PvP its disgusting that they can wear the same armor as me. Granted cnt can reduce this dmg but its a fry cry from the defenses we need against the kinds of hedious hits they can deal.

Suggested patch (please read BEFORE you spaz):

-Your armor class is reduced immediately to 600 when you have a staff equipped

-With this nerf you NOW have the ability to equip an archery set but not fire said set it if you have a staff equipped.

-You still reap the stat bonuses of items (including armor and archery items) if you have a staff equipped.

-An armor potion's effect is erased when a staff is equipped.

-You cannot equip an ironclad rune and a staff at the same time.

-Armor Class is reduced to 800 when a whip is equipped.

-You are still able to reap the benifits of Armor Class potions/runes with a whip equipped.

- A 25% Armor Class bonus to any class that does not have a staff or whip equipped and has a complete set of one level of armor. This bonus would be 25% of total armor class including buffs: AC pots/IC rune. (~This bonus would exclude anyone who's concenration points or intelligence points are higher than their total strength points or dexterity points.)

-Mirrored blade now applies to 1h weapons (excluding whips and crushing weapons) with the skill's porc cut in half for each weapon.

(As if staff users can use MB and 1h slashers cant!!!! WTH?!?!)

This is my idea for a more fair playing ground for pvp action. I'm at end game and really disappointed in what im seeing. I've poured alot of work into 1h slashing, as did many others, and I am constantly having my melee butt handed to me by staffies regardless of how much str/dex I have...

I'm not hatin' on satffies, I like them, they are powerful allies, I would just like to see them a little more squishy is all.

One final thought: staff users should be able to have LIMITLESS amounts of damage and even FURTHER buffs to amplify it, but they need to pay a heavier price for their ability to hit as hard as they do...

hotshot64 · 09-30-2010, 07:52 PM

Agreed. Just as a shield user is defense oriented and therefore suffers a 50% reduction in dps, a caster that does massive damage should suffer a reduction in defense.

Smashbros · 09-30-2010, 08:07 PM

bwahahahaha best troll thread yet

Soul Thrift · 09-30-2010, 08:10 PM

I dont think Glitch would like to program an a'uto AC decreaser' onto all staves, or even a 'no ironclad rune'. Then adding AC decreaser to whips, AC bonus to all without. Sounds like work not going to get done. coughDawncough.
Mirrored blade was made for those with 2h because there were dual wield/dual parry. So to make that work for 1 handers is kind of unfair.

I do understand there are barely any skills to decrease magic damage. All that you can do is level various impediment magic skills banish light/null mind/ etc... get better Cnt.

All you can do is kill the caster fast and hope there isnt another.

Soul Thrift · 09-30-2010, 08:11 PM

oh yeah there are also magic resist aura gems. so you could always buy a bunch of those to fill gem slots

Huggles · 09-30-2010, 08:22 PM

I like the idea, but too many casters would whine like no tomorrow. Would also make PvE impossible for whip tanks and casters.

Dumpsterslut · 09-30-2010, 08:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Soul Thrift

Mirrored blade was made for those with 2h because there were dual wield/dual parry. So to make that work for 1 handers is kind of unfair.

If dual parry did dmg I wouldnt say anything about MB. There is a parry skill for 2h weapons...its called "parry". I dont see how its unfiar that we get MB

not trying to sound rude, just stating the facts. Thank you for respoding Thrifty <3.

flipynifty · 09-30-2010, 10:07 PM

good idear

Monu · 09-30-2010, 10:15 PM

Buff regeners! =)

10-01-2010, 04:50 AM

just get a shield and STFU ^_^

Conqueror · 10-01-2010, 06:27 AM

I agree with you 200%.

Every other RPG that I know of forces casters to wear weaker armor. It is a fair trade off for their high damage potential in my opinion.

But there are too many people in Nodiatis with their own self interest at stake for this to ever go through.

Perhaps, casters could be given some sort of a damage bonus, if their armor class is lower. I am thinking of the melee skill where the lower the health bar is, the more damage the melee character can do. Casters could get something similar where they are able to do a greater amount of damage if they lower their armor class. So a caster with like 100 armor class would hit a lot harder than a caster with 2k +.

Melee toons could get some sort of a defensive boost if their armor class total is higher.

Since archers are also supposed to be lightly armored, archers could get something half way in between the other two types (damage boost with a lower armor class total or defensive boost with a higher armor class total). The effect would have to be scaled down for archers because they are middle group characters. But they could potentially lean both ways.

Just an idea.

Smashbros · 10-01-2010, 06:51 AM

well conq seeing as you feel that way i suggest this as a counter:

seeing as you think casters should have massive damage and low defence. if your halfing their armor and setting a cap on their ac, then i counter suggest that all casters have their damage trippled.

Conqueror · 10-01-2010, 07:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Smashbros

well conq seeing as you feel that way i suggest this as a counter:

seeing as you think casters should have massive damage and low defence. if your halfing their armor and setting a cap on their ac, then i counter suggest that all casters have their damage trippled.

Well not trippled. Maybe trippled if they have 1 hit point.

I edited my post above and suggested something similar.

I see the problem what Dumpy is pointing out and I agree with what he said. I have seen quite a few casters with 10k + hitpoints and 2k + armor class. Add their healing potential to the mix with the angelic aura, potions, tempers and runes and they are pretty strong defensively. I know that it is a fad to say that casters are weak defensively but in some ways, this is simply not true.

I guess that this should just be left as it is, at the end of the day though.

10-01-2010, 07:12 AM

lol to clarify...

conquerer is milfhunter

and the level 80 huggles grouped with that got pwnd in 10 seconds was milfhunter.

Dump you need to work on your defense and sthu. kthxbaaaaiiiii <3 <3 <3

Nemesiss · 10-01-2010, 07:56 AM

dump i <3 ya but you and most people in forums need to at least get your skills up, and i mean all of them defense/wep mainly before suggesting game changes and vs casters a good amount of cnt.. you can have the best wep/armor/gems in game but unless you have the skills to back them up they will still fail.

thatperson · 10-01-2010, 08:16 AM

@ conq casters may not be as weak defensively as some claim but they are weaker but they are also not as strong offensively in PvP as you always seem to think considering (someone did the correct math in another thread earlier) you can get a 95% chance to completely avoid caster damage while melee is considerablly smaller than that now idk about you but no matter how high u can hit if ur only hitting 1 outta 20 shots not too great

Tragicallyhip · 10-01-2010, 08:25 AM

If you give casters double or triple dmg.... You're talking about buffing them to where they will be unmatchable. You want to lower their AC and def, when all they need is a few seconds with the right gem draw to trash your ass anyway.... You aren't going to make San cry if he has 600 Ac but does double or triple Dmg, or Neo, Mort, Sonera... They will wreck you over and over again, even if you had good skills.

Only counter... have 100 blocking and deflect.... lol... or get wasted, and even that probably won't be enough. The 5% that gets through will WTF PWN you.

Soul Thrift · 10-01-2010, 08:34 AM

Its true there arent any 1 handed defense skill with spells. MB does mirror DD damage but its not really usefull for a caster counter.

I do like the idea of putting archers, melee, and casters into armor based tiers. Like archers cant wear any breast plate over ** rock like casters, or even not being able to wear armor that is over ** AC. The only problem I see is that programming it into the system would be a pain.

Another idea would be to have the 3 groups do a rock, paper, scissors situation. Caster<Archer Caster>Melee Archer<Melee
If you want a cute explanation. Caster gets pwned by archer as cast radius is weaker the further you are away from each other. Melee pwns archer as an archer is slow to pull out arrows when the attacker is right next to them slashing with a sword. Casters pwn melee because attackers are weak minded. Even putting damage increasers against a certain class will be a pain to program. So that throws that out.

I really think the only way classes will even out without reprogamming is by adding more gems. Thats really all Glitchless can do. A DD reducer gem is an idea, just like range/melee reducer, but we already have auras that cause **% damage reduction from a certain color magic. We already have a DD enhancer, which seems unfair, but we also have swiftarrow/quicksteel ; if you are in a clan with those options for you.

The only reason i can think of for not putting in armor class restrictions is because it IS like every other game, it IS the norm. If you played RWK its almost the same. You can have any equipment you want but there are quest items which make everything more powerful. You should see the unfairness there.

10-01-2010, 11:52 AM

hotshot64 · 10-01-2010, 06:44 PM

First: regardless of what you say, it is impossible to have 95% resistance without EXTREMELY GOOD cnt. And if your cnt is that high, you lose hp. Resist 19 DD gems, great. In the meantime you just did 2k damage to the enemy with your club. Awesome. Then you get hit with the one that DOES go through, and it does 3500 damage. with your reduced dur, that's half your hp. Lucky you. Not to mention DoT casters ignore shields and ac anyway. So even if DD casters are balanced, that's just making DoT casters stronger in comparison.